806 replies to this topic

[AxlsMainMan]

The government relies on taxes to operate, so really, they don't provide us with anything independent of our taxes since you want to play that card. With universal health care, the government alocates funds collected as taxes for health care for its population. Through this method, everyone is ensured health care, and can sleep soundly knowing that they wont have to sell the house or use their child's tuition to pay for an unexpected surgery. If everyone was left up to their own devices, there would be people who would be without health care due to cost. Through a process of taxation, this is eliminated. This would seem to fall under one of the purposes of a representative democracy: i.e. that people are elected to ensure that the safety and well-being of their populace is tended to. What's the point in having a representative democracy if there is no one around to enjoy it since everyone has died of avoidable and treatable conditions? Or take Cousin It's leg for example. That could have been treated the day it happened if he resided here in Canada. But instead, he has to suffer because selfish individuals such as yourself are too stingy and devoid of compassion to see it as an obligation inherent in yourself to ensure the well-being of those around you.

[Mr. Roboto]

9 patients made nearly 2,700 ER visits in Texas AP 2 hrs 7 mins ago AUSTIN, Texas – Just nine people accounted for nearly 2,700 of the emergency room visits in the Austin area during the past six years at a cost of $3 million to taxpayers and others, according to a report. The patients went to hospital emergency rooms 2,678 times from 2003 through 2008, said the report from the nonprofit Integrated Care Collaboration, a group of health care providers who care for low-income and uninsured patients. "What we're really trying to do is find out who's using our emergency rooms ... and find solutions," said Ann Kitchen, executive director of the group, which presented the report last week to the Travis County Healthcare District board. The average emergency room visit costs $1,000. Hospitals and taxpayers paid the bill through government programs such as Medicare and Medicaid, Kitchen said. Eight of the nine patients have drug abuse problems, seven were diagnosed with mental health issues and three were homeless. Five are women whose average age is 40, and four are men whose average age is 50, the report said, the Austin American-Statesman reported Wednesday. "It's a pretty significant issue," said Dr. Christopher Ziebell, chief of the emergency department at University Medical Center at Brackenridge, which has the busiest ERs in the area. Solutions include referring some frequent users to mental health programs or primary care doctors for future care, Ziebell said. "They have a variety of complaints," he said. With mental illness, "a lot of anxiety manifests as chest pain."

[cousin it]

I would be willing to wager that the majority of those 2700 were "seekers". We used to have that problem here, but a couple of years ago the state instituted a state wide computerized prescription data base that reduced the problem. Unfortunately, not all pharmacists log all of the prescriptions, so doctor shopping is still a problem.

[Macker]

I would be willing to wager that the majority of those 2700 were "seekers". We used to have that problem here, but a couple of years ago the state instituted a state wide computerized prescription data base that reduced the problem.

Unfortunately, not all pharmacists log all of the prescriptions, so doctor shopping is still a problem.

I heard this on the way home from work today. I'm not positive if I heard right but of those 2700 only a handful were largely responsible for the millions?

9 patients made nearly 2,700 ER visits in Texas

AUSTIN, Texas (AP) — Just nine people accounted for nearly 2,700 of the emergency room visits in the Austin area during the past six years at a cost of $3 million to taxpayers and others, according to a report. The patients went to hospital emergency rooms 2,678 times from 2003 through 2008, said the report from the nonprofit Integrated Care Collaboration, a group of health care providers who care for low-income and uninsured patients. “What we’re really trying to do is find out who’s using our emergency rooms ... and find solutions,“ said Ann Kitchen, executive director of the group, which presented the report last week to the Travis County Healthcare District board. Out of the 9, three were homeless and the rest were drug abusers.

[PERM BANNED]

y

[Mr. Roboto]

I heard this on the way home from work today. I'm not positive if I heard right but of those 2700 only a handful were largely responsible for the millions?

9 patients made nearly 2,700 ER visits in Texas.............................

Please check before posting....it's the same thread fer chrissake!

[AxlsMainMan]

^^ Get a load of Ronald Raygun.

[Macker]

I heard this on the way home from work today. I'm not positive if I heard right but of those 2700 only a handful were largely responsible for the millions?

9 patients made nearly 2,700 ER visits in Texas.............................

Please check before posting....it's the same thread fer chrissake!

Fuck You Nanner Puss, I had clowns to the left of me and jokers to the right. Sorry!

[freedom78]

The government relies on taxes to operate, so really, they don't provide us with anything independent of our taxes since you want to play that card.

With universal health care, the government alocates funds collected as taxes for health care for its population.

Through this method, everyone is ensured health care, and can sleep soundly knowing that they wont have to sell the house or use their child's tuition to pay for an unexpected surgery.

If everyone was left up to their own devices, there would be people who would be without health care due to cost.

Through a process of taxation, this is eliminated.

This would seem to fall under one of the purposes of a representative democracy: i.e. that people are elected to ensure that the safety and well-being of their populace is tended to.

What's the point in having a representative democracy if there is no one around to enjoy it since everyone has died of avoidable and treatable conditions?

Or take Cousin It's leg for example. That could have been treated the day it happened if he resided here in Canada. But instead, he has to suffer because selfish individuals such as yourself are too stingy and devoid of compassion to see it as an obligation inherent in yourself to ensure the well-being of those around you.

Yes, I'm a selfish prick. I'm to blame for the woes of society. Nevermind the epidemic of loss in the concept of personal responsibility. It's my fucking fault that "you" chose to get high, do poorly in school, work at some McJob, have kids that you can't afford and now I should be held responsible for your healthcare because you failed to make yourself competitive in a fairly simple game.

I'm trying really hard to keep my cool, so I'm going to go away for a while because I don't appreciate being attacked.

It boggles the mind how self responsibility is fleeting from society more and more each day. People truly do have an absurd sense of entitlement.

Ah, personal responsibility. I love that old mantra. How simple! I'll just quit my "McJob" and get a new job in upper level management somewhere. Why didn't I think of that?

Seriously, I know you know that not everyone can be the CEO, so I fail to understand why, in discussing such issues, conservative folks tend to fall back on stereotypes and treat this like a black and white issue. Everyone without healthcare is stoned, super intelligent but too lazy to work hard, flips burgers for a living, and has an octo-mom at home. Gimme a break. Not everyone can have the "good" jobs. It isn't possible, despite your belief in responsibility seeming to claim so. If a burger flipper moves up, someone probably moves down. The only difference is that I don't feel like punishing any of those people to a life where they can't afford to see a doctor when they're ill.

So, yes, if we have universal healthcare it will cover all of conservatism's boogeymen. The lazy, the stupid, addicts...the whole lot. But those people go to the doctor. And when they don't pay, everyone else's fees rise to cover that cost (also see the above posts re: emergency rooms). On the other hand, it would also cover hard working people (MILLIONS of them) who have a job with crappy benefits, or who just got laid off because society's "worthwhile" people can't run a business for shit. I know the argument works better when it only applies to the lazy and addicted, but that just isn't reality.

I'm all for personal responsibility, but there's also a collective responsibility. If there weren't, we wouldn't have a national defense or any government at all, for that matter.

[cousin it]

Too, most health care providers have a clause that exempt pre-existing conditions.

[Macker]

Some do, most probably won't. Some will except pre-existing conditions after a certain requirement or agreement has been made with an employer and their carrier. Mostly that is with self insured agencies......

[freedom78]

Some do, most probably won't. Some will except pre-existing conditions after a certain requirement or agreement has been made with an employer and their carrier. Mostly that is with self insured agencies......

In my own personal experience, a pre-existing condition is often accepted IF and ONLY IF you were insured immediately prior to initiating that new policy. In other words...you didn't sign up BECAUSE you got sick. I can understand why you do it, from a business sense, but it really makes no sense in some respects as a societal policy. If you don't HAVE insurance, you don't go to the doc until it gets serious. Then, when you do go, it's far too much to afford. If we'd simply insure everyone and let them go when they first get sick, the cost of treatment would be far less. This is, generally, one of the things Obama means when he talks about a "down payment". Initially the costs rise, but in a few years some of these things decline. I also don't think health insurance should be a for-profit business. When fucking over your customers HELPS your bottom line, it's time to change the approach.

[Mr. Roboto]

From my personal experience "pre-existing" conditions are accepted with group coverage, but not with individual plans. When I had my own insurance my asthma inhalers and allergy meds wouldn't be covered because I had a history of using them. With my wife's insurance, I can get these no problem. Insurance companies suck cock, hate 'em.

[freedom78]

From my personal experience "pre-existing" conditions are accepted with group coverage, but not with individual plans. When I had my own insurance my asthma inhalers and allergy meds wouldn't be covered because I had a history of using them. With my wife's insurance, I can get these no problem. Insurance companies suck cock, hate 'em.

That may be true. Most of my plans have been group, so I can't speak to the individual plans (which are exorbitantly expensive).

One thing about individual plans...a LOT of them do NOT cover pregnancy expenses, and if you want them to you have to up your premium a shit ton. My wife used to be on my group coverage through school, and was covered. But we looked into separate insurance for her and it was ridiculously priced if you included pregnancy benefits. Their explanation was that if you want them, then you must be trying to get pregnant...which wasn't true at all of us...we simply didn't think it made any sense for a woman in her 20s to have insurance that didn't cover the most likely super-expensive medical situation she was likely to encounter. Needless to say, we didn't get her that insurance.

[LISA]

sorry. all that just sounds absurd to me. here, you just get it done. you go to the doc, the specialisty,have surgery whatever the case is regardless of pre-existing/existing/soon to be existing..again whatever the case. Our government has it's population best interests at heart. without the people, you have nothing. Randal..yes, I am argumentative with you and yes, I take offense to almost all of what you say. It isn't personal persay, just I cannot believe that someone as pigheaded and arrogant as you come off to be,exists. Good fucking thing you SERVE your country because you are not good for much else with that attitude. I cannot even fathom how the US can effect change at all with people like you. Despite the cost you should want the best for the people of American, your family ,friends..the poor..the children and families that don't get enough to eat and either go to school or go to bed, hungry..for the family who has an asthmatic child and sacrifices the grocery bill to get the meds the child needs or the family of moderate mean trying to care for a hospitalized loved one. You talk and talk and think you know what is good for you country, your opinion reallys means squat if you do not get behind something as basic as equal and free healthcare. DO NOT even assume that you know how it works in Canada. DO NOT even try to say that you read something that says...you don't live here, you never will and you have no clue, so before you even start THAT argument, don't. My opinion is nothing really because I am not a US citizen but I did experience..I lived in PA and NY state for 5 years, long enough to see, to learn. I continued to drive to Canada for my healthcare and even drove to Canada to have both my kids.K,I have ranted and riled so long now, I have gone somewhat askew of the topic... Basically just wanted you to know that I will always continue to attack you if I do not agree with your ridiculous,ignorant,arrogant comments..just how I roll...wake up before it is too late or I feel sorry for your aging population and your family. No hard feelings eh?