52 replies to this topic

[TAP]

Does anyone think this wek's events may have even more long term impact than 9/11? I was in NYC on 9/11 - the focus as I remember was getting back to 'normal' as soon as possible. Shutting down a huge city is the big story this week to catch one terrorist, not the terrorism itself.

[Mr. Roboto]

From what I've read Boston seems to pretty much be back to normal already.

In regards to shutting the city down, I think this is the first time (correct me if I'm wrong) that they started an aggressive manhunt for the suspected terrorists in the same city after an attack occurred. I also see this as a public safety issue, much like a hurricane approaching a city. We are told to stay indoors, stay off the roads, or get out of the city altogether by our government. These men carjacked a civilian, killed another cop and threw explosives out the window as they were chased. I'd imagine even more people could be dead if they were in the path of these desperate terrorists.

I do no know the timeline, so I'm not sure when they shut it all down, however if they had a pretty good lock on where these dickheads were, I don't necessarily disagree with telling everybody to stay inside. I'm not sure how else they could have handled it and maybe they didn't either since this was a first?

[PERM BANNED]

I think it's an interesting idea to discuss. I certainly appreciate the need for security and by keeping people off the streets, there are less distractions. But under what authority does a local police or mayor have the power to tell everyone they can't walk around, or that businesses can't stay open. I've been in those circumstances, albeit not in the US. But they closed down an entire city to hunt for one man. It wasn't stopping a 9/11 or another attack. It was to hunt for one guy. If they could do it for him, what about the next time some drunk red neck beats his wife and evades the police? I know it's not simple, but I wouldn't be surprised if it doesn't go to court. I'm not trying to compare it to the level of injustice as Japanese internment, but a lot of people got behind that idea too. And while the courts found it legal, I wonder if that would be the conclusion today, and most people wouldn't support that kind of encroachment in today's world. Will they in future look at Boston as a bad thing?

[TAP]

I think Boston will prove to be a huge hit on civil liberties. Terrorists will see how easy it is to shut down a city, and the government will use it as precedent. I'm not sure what is more scary - if this was a planned reaction to terrorism, or a knee jerk reaction - either way I think it's catastrophic. And that's from my liberal/libertarian point of view - Democratic President, Governor and Mayor, I'm not pointing finger at GOP.

Also remember that it took some guy going out for a cigarette and seeing blood after the restrictions were lifted, so closing down the city did not work. And like Flagg says, it was one guy. It's tragic that 4 died and so many were hurt, but people die and are hurt all the time by criminal actions - it's always heartless to dismiss someone's suffering as statistics, but why should death by terrorism warrant a different response to death by regular homicide.

[freedom78]

I think Boston will prove to be a huge hit on civil liberties. Terrorists will see how easy it is to shut down a city, and the government will use it as precedent. I'm not sure what is more scary - if this was a planned reaction to terrorism, or a knee jerk reaction - either way I think it's catastrophic. And that's from my liberal/libertarian point of view - Democratic President, Governor and Mayor, I'm not pointing finger at GOP.

Did they force people to be off the streets or simply ask them to because of the ongoing situation? In other words, when someone violated this "order" (suggestion?) was that person arrested, escorted home, or simply informed of the situation with a strong recommendation to stay indoors? I really have no idea which of the above happened. It's one thing to completely shut down a street where you suspect this guy is hiding and know that bullets may be flying, but beyond that it's excessive.

Also remember that it took some guy going out for a cigarette and seeing blood after the restrictions were lifted, so closing down the city did not work. And like Flagg says, it was one guy. It's tragic that 4 died and so many were hurt, but people die and are hurt all the time by criminal actions - it's always heartless to dismiss someone's suffering as statistics, but why should death by terrorism warrant a different response to death by regular homicide.

I agree that death by terrorism isn't all that much different than death by any other "normal" form of murder. But I do see terrorism much differently, largely because the audience for an act of terror is not the group of people killed or injured but the rest of the people who think "it coulda been me". Rare is the case where someone is murdered (non-terror) with the purpose of striking fear into all the other non-murdered people. It's also worth noting that terror differs because of the potential for further carnage. If I murder someone, it's likely for a reason and also likely that this single act would be the end of it. My one murder doesn't beget more murder because the point wasn't to kill as many people as possible but to kill that one specific person for some specific reason. These guys set off two bombs, at least one other was found and dismantled, so I see them as much more of an ongoing threat than a suspected murderer of the normal sort.

[TAP]

I think there was no mandatory order to be off streets, but it was dealt with differently depending on which police you happened to encounter. I don't think people's rights were explicitly restricted - it's more the fact that people were so complicit, it's precedent for next time and becomes standard procedure. I doubt many people were out walking/driving down streets with militarized law enforcement.

Yes, terror obviously has the intent of creating fear. But suspect shutting down city contributed significantly to that fear.

[TAP]

wow....

http://www.getonhand...ootout-pictures

[Mr. Roboto]

That's fucking nuts. I would have been in the basement for sure myself.