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#61 PERM BANNED

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Posted 07 October 2011 - 11:05 PM

If you really must know, a person droped her ID badge in the toilet. Rather than suck it up and pull it out, she tried to flush it. The place had shoddy plumbing and everything in the septic for the past several hours came back up through all the toilets leaving three inches of water and waste all over their bathroom.



So you did this once? It reads like you did it 70 hours/week. And why the emphasis on *women's* feces? Unless you cleaned men's and women's feces and the women's was harder work for some reason, the fact that it was women's seems totally superfluous to your resume.



I really don't want to get into the details of what i did as a janitor as that wasn't the point. The men's plumbing was seperate from the women's bathroom and the women has a habit of flushing tampons and other objects which resulted messes on multiple occasions. My so called resume, highly selective and intentionally general was a directed towards the overly simplified photos located on the site Whistler provided. I did work 70 hour weeks for an extended period of time. Though if you want to know, it was a combination of multiple part time jobs and one full time. I also poured concrete for a buddy early in the morning too. But those stories aren't as dramatic as saying I cleaned up shit. And let's be honest, saying you cleaned up feces in a women's bathroom comes across as more demeaning than saying you cleaned bathrooms. But I have a feeling you know this.

If you look at all those postings, very few are from the middle aged types SLC mentioned. I acknowledge a lot of middle class, hard working americans were screwed by their investments. But I don't feel sorry for them as the risk of loss is inherent in the stock market. People take that risk knowing that over the long run, statistics show they'll come out ahead. We blame the sub prime loans, but what politicans were pushing for them? Going so far as to drop the race card to get them pushed through. The sub prime market was managed by Fannie and Freddie, government entities. If the banks wouldn't have known their asses would be saved, they never would have issued those loans and millions wouldn't have been hurt by their collapse.

These OWS are asking for more handouts. So what's to stop another government program from saying "give these people easy money" only to have it collapse again in 10-20 years.



SLC nailed it when he said all people aren't created equal. Everyone isn't free to follow their heart's desire. That lesbian making indie rock music can't be upset when she's broke and can't survive on her own. There's not a demand for that style of art. She did what she thought would make her happy rather than what would make her financially succesful. And that's the problem. People feel entitled to a high standard of living (and that definiton is constantly moving forward) without the risk. Of all the people on this forum who have made their occupations known to me, none of them were accidents. TAP didn't wake up a Math professor. Freedom didn't get asked while working at McDonalds to teach Political Science. SLC didn't get picked from a pool of contestants to be in real estate. All of those occupations and the status associated with them were earned through work and determination. We're not all equal. No with our skill sets, genetics, or opportunities and starting points in life. The true free market and capitalism offer the best chance for upward mobility. I can't think of one fortune 500 company that appeared out of thin air. It started as some mom and pop shop and grew to international success. From Heinz ketchup, to Ford automobiles to Wal-Mart.

I have a philosophical issue with the argument that because someone is alive and a human being, they're entitled to the fruit of other's labor. People often badmouth the trust fund types, but somewhere down the line a family memebr rose from the ranks to earn that wealth. Just as you find it acceptable to send your offspring to good schools and provide for them in a better manner due to your personal financial success, the Sam Walton's of the world are entitled to pass on the benefits of their success to whom they choose. And that's really what this is about. The request if not demand for a social safety net that empowers the lowest contributors of our soceity to an equal status. Personal preference to contribution aside, it's really quite objective in our society in what we value financially. So to return to Art's post regarding the artist in NYC, obviously her emails to alleged suicidal teens isn't as monetarily valuable as GM's production line.

They're saying tax the rich, but what do we do with that money once we tax them? Do we pay off the national debt with it or do they want us to pass out personal checks until everyone reaches a median level of income? Bottom line is this. I value true freedom. Freedom from government involvement in my life. That is the basis for this country. That is the American way. You can't find me any documentation from the founders suggesting redistribution of wealth. No, Thomas Paine wasn't a founding father, no matter how many times rawstory tries to say his later articles were seriously considered. We've seen what angry masses looking for someone else to blame can lead to. And with the rapid growth of government under the past two adminstrations, call me a concerned party when it comes to people massing in the streets asking for big brother to come save them.
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#62 PERM BANNED

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Posted 07 October 2011 - 11:11 PM

[blockquote]
I am a teacher.

My family’s health insurance depends on my job.

My state govt. is out to cut my retirement benefits like health care.

My kids owe a quarter of a million $ in student loans.

My friends in their 60’s keep working because they can’t afford to retire, so those jobs are not available to young people.

We are the 99%
[/blockquote]


And that's the kind of crap that is disingenuous. Who made her kids take out loans for quarter of a million dollars? Why would they do that. College does not cost that much unless you attend the incredibly costly private schools. In which case, they gambled that their fancy degrees would secure them a well paying job to offset their debt. i don't feel sorry for them, and I'll be damned if I'll portray them as a victim. Why can't her friends afford to retire. She doesn't say if her friends had a million dollars saved up and lost it or if they bought crack for the past fourtty years and smoked it all away. She doesn't describe what benefits she has and how they're in jeopardy. Is she just using some public union scare tactic, or is she really in danger. It's all jibberish and not any of it says, I made a mistake. That's the thing. None of these OWS people are posting stories about how they fucked up. It's all "I got screwed" with no reflection as to how they got there. And I'll be damned if we allow sob stories without any substantiation to back them up serve as the justification to dismantle this country.
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#63 Guest_Whistler's Momma_*

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Posted 07 October 2011 - 11:24 PM

I think the other thing that people forget is that we all aren't created equal. It's easy to say "Why didn't this person just do this, this and THIS?"

It must occur that not everybody is as resourceful as the next guy. I thank my lucky stars everyday, and I often talk about it with my wife. I know so many people who rack up credit card debt for simple life things: Car repairs, home repairs etc. These aren't people who are lazy or living beyond their means, these are everyday people getting their asses kicked just like the rest of us. Life isn't easy.

When I was younger I learned to work on cars because I got tired of being ripped off by mechanics. Because of this I have saved thousands and thousands of dollars over the course of my adult life. Something most people get hammered on. When I hear what people pay for brake jobs, or even a simple spark plug change, I cringe. Same with home stuff, I've saved thousands of dollars over the course of my adult life simply because I've taught myself to do these things. Not that these things require a high degree of skill, but not everybody can do them. I learned out of economic necessity. Would I rather spend 1000 bucks on a car repair or put that in my retirement account? OK, I'll learn to turn a wrench....

There are so many ways to save money in life, especially now with the internet. You can sleuth down all kinds of deals for whatever you want. I needed a new cruise control motor for my car. Unit price? 1600 bucks before labor! I went on car forums and found a guy who totaled the same car and was parting it out. My cost? 125 bucks for his part and put it in myself. The everyday guy would have had to pony up the money, or get a newer car. Does that make the average guy lazy or bad because he had a car repair that exceeded his checking account and was forced to use a credit card? Was he/she irresponsible for not knowing how to do that repair themselves? Hardly.

The same attitude exists towards homeless people, or the poor. "Well all they have to do is this to get on their feet"

Well it may not occur to them to do "this"...ever. They simply don't possess the ability to think in such a way, where we do. Because of this I am thankful, and don't look down on others as incompetent or lazy. Nor would I ever toot my own horn about how smart and hardworking I am and what a big crybaby everybody else is.

Financially I run my house like a business. I am constantly looking for a way to save money, cut costs, and save (assets.) I also realize that I can do this for another 25 years and then suffer an illness, or incur some sort of devastating financial blow that screws me at the finish line. That is often how life works, and that's why I think it's best to remain thankful and humble about any accomplishments in life. You might be surprised how quickly all of it can be taken away from you.



Not everyone is able to be a jack of all trades. They just don't have a mechanic bone in their bodies or they can't handle the pressure of working all day at a job and coming home to more work. You're lucky you got the right combination of skill, ambition and time to do your own work.

My husband was the same way before he became disabled. He could fix anything from his street sweepers, front end loaders, and pick up trucks to everything around the house. Between the two of us we did all our own household maintenance, remodeling and redecorating plus did the same in the apartment building we owned free and clear. Then in a heartbeat that all changed and he hasn't walked, talked or used his arm since. We were luckier than a lot of people we've since met in the disabled community because we had a lot of assets that we could sell and downsize enabling us to build a wheelchair friend house. People take so many things for granted---that they will always be healthy, that they can invest wisely and never experience hard times---but life does throw you lemons when you least expect it and through no fault of your own. I am grateful every day that our "lemon" came before the housing market crashed or we'd be bankrupted now, trying to keep up a bunch of properties we couldn't sell or maintain by ourselves anymore and my husband would be a nursing home.

#64 Mr. Roboto

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Posted 07 October 2011 - 11:46 PM

I agree with some of what you're saying, but you're also omitting how America was compared to how it is today. I think a lot of the anger is rooted in this change for the worse. The corporations have slowly whittled away the worker's benefits to further profits and keep Wall Street happy. What workers were given instead was "free market" solutions (401ks) instead of pensions that guaranteed the worker something at the end. Now they want to get rid of social security and Medicare. They won't do it overnight, but they've already convinced enough people that it's a "ponzi scheme" and they will whittle that away over the next few decades too. They'll get it too I'd imagine, one day it will be 86'd.

Now speaking of risk, risk IS part of investing. However it was Wall Street that took these risks that crashed the market, not the people who invested in their 401ks trying to save for retirement. You can't short your retirement portfolio, but the hedge firms certainly can; in other words they win either way. The average American is taught to dollar cost average over time, ride the dips and the peaks and you'll come out ahead. That's a tough line to buy after the last decade. In a normal market yea sure, but in one that is allowed to run riot, then how does the average guy stand a chance at coming out ahead? What I saw is a group of firms who had trillions of dollars, financed by middle America and was shamelessly reckless with it. After they burned everything to the ground, they asked for money from the tax payers to keep them afloat. The sad reality is that while I hated (and still hate) the thought of socializing loss, it was necessary to stop everything from going down the toilet. Seeing the DOW get cut in half is one thing, seeing it lose 90% of value is quite another.

The subprime loans that went to shit were financed and then resold by WS. They set up "home lending" companies backed with their own money to get into the game. True Subprime loans have a default rate akin regular borrowers when they adhere to the same qualification process. Furthermore it wasn't just subprime loans, it was Alt A and strategic defaults that also brought the house of cards down. The Fannie and Freddie thing is overblown at best. I'm sure my angry Republican cousin would disagree, continuing to place blame on all the "poor people" who lost their homes. His selective amnesia always gets in the way though, since he had 9 properties of his own go back to the bank from Tampa to Miami. In other words, this is hardly about "those people" who should not have gotten loans. It's about all kinds of people walking away when the values went south.

Second problem that didn't protect the American workers (and their investments) was the failed ratings system. Moodys etc who gave AAA ratings to these shit investments (bundled sub prime notes.) We never would have gotten off the ground if they had been rated properly. I'd say this is the least talked about issue, and IMO one of the biggest culprits of our economic demise. Again, Goldman Sachs knew they were dogshit, even so much as to short them. So how is that fair to the American public? Surely they knew that the day would come where the house of cards would fall, but why worry? They make money either way. American investors assumed what they thought was normal market risk, not that crazy shit. As America watched it's portfolios burn, Sachs got billions in bailout money. Can you see why this would chap people's collective asses?

BOA same thing. Taking bailout money and then charging people excessive fees, not working with them on home loan modifications etc. That's fucked up.

Firms today, running lean and mean....and not hiring. They are sitting on record profits, a surplus of cash in the trillions. But no hiring? Do they have to? No they are not obligated to hire anybody. But can't you see why people are pissed?

My father worked for GE for 30 years (or so) and then retired. That was common for a man of his generation. He was able to buy company stock over those three decades at a discount, as well as get a pension when he retired. He had job security up until the last five years, when they were constantly offering him packages to retire early. He was one of the only full time employees with benefits in his office by the time he left. This simply does not happen today for Middle America. Benefits are slashed, your job security is poor, and for retirement you get to give your money to WS and pray it doesn't vanish overnight. Of course by the time you hit your prime earning age, 50's, you have a high chance of getting laid off so some kid can replace you for half the salary. Good luck getting a job in your 50's too.
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#65 Guest_Whistler's Momma_*

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Posted 08 October 2011 - 12:06 AM

[blockquote]
I am a teacher.

My family’s health insurance depends on my job.

My state govt. is out to cut my retirement benefits like health care.

My kids owe a quarter of a million $ in student loans.

My friends in their 60’s keep working because they can’t afford to retire, so those jobs are not available to young people.

We are the 99%
[/blockquote]


And that's the kind of crap that is disingenuous. Who made her kids take out loans for quarter of a million dollars? Why would they do that. College does not cost that much unless you attend the incredibly costly private schools. In which case, they gambled that their fancy degrees would secure them a well paying job to offset their debt. i don't feel sorry for them, and I'll be damned if I'll portray them as a victim. Why can't her friends afford to retire. She doesn't say if her friends had a million dollars saved up and lost it or if they bought crack for the past fourtty years and smoked it all away. She doesn't describe what benefits she has and how they're in jeopardy. Is she just using some public union scare tactic, or is she really in danger. It's all jibberish and not any of it says, I made a mistake. That's the thing. None of these OWS people are posting stories about how they fucked up. It's all "I got screwed" with no reflection as to how they got there. And I'll be damned if we allow sob stories without any substantiation to back them up serve as the justification to dismantle this country.


Disingenuous? One: you don't know how many kids the woman has whose student loans add up to a quarter of a million dollars---it could be two or ten kids. So why do you assume the worst, they they are in private schools or "gambling on fancy degrees"? You don't have a clue from what little is written on her 99% note. Two: As for her friends who can't retire, I have a lot of older friends in the same position now and, no, they didn't buy crack. Did you miss the stock market crash a couple of years ago? It wiped out a lot of people's pension/retirement money. And, three, you'd have to be obviously to the news not to know what kinds of benefits are being taken away from teachers. Four, if anyone is trying to "dismantle" the country, it's the Tea Party Republicans in Congress, not the working middle class who have lost all stability over the past few years.

#66 artcinco

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Posted 08 October 2011 - 09:34 AM

This thread is crying out for reborn rolla.


I tried to find him awhile back. No luck. He seems to have gone off the grid in America's hat (© Supernaut).

He always had time to send some whiteboard to the ladies.
Why do you read that kind of crap, Art? Seriously, I don't get it.

#67 artcinco

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Posted 08 October 2011 - 09:53 AM

I heard on the radio that the OWS thing was cooked up by the unions to help make Obama seem more centrist in contrast. That way the independents will think that he isn't as whack as those OWC peeps and not as staunchy like those Tea types so POTUS gets to triangulate himself into a second term. Posted Image
Why do you read that kind of crap, Art? Seriously, I don't get it.

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Posted 08 October 2011 - 10:57 AM





They're saying tax the rich, but what do we do with that money once we tax them? Do we pay off the national debt with it or do they want us to pass out personal checks until everyone reaches a median level of income? Bottom line is this. I value true freedom. Freedom from government involvement in my life. That is the basis for this country. That is the American way. You can't find me any documentation from the founders suggesting redistribution of wealth. No, Thomas Paine wasn't a founding father, no matter how many times rawstory tries to say his later articles were seriously considered. We've seen what angry masses looking for someone else to blame can lead to. And with the rapid growth of government under the past two adminstrations, call me a concerned party when it comes to people massing in the streets asking for big brother to come save them.


Says the guy who lets the government pick out the color of his underwear. The government is involved in every aspect of your life including the fact that you get a big-time exemption on your tax returns when you service in a war zone. Do you know that soldiers taking that exemption thus paying no income taxes if they service in a combat zone for a year are counted among those 50% of people who don't pay taxes? Do you consider them to be sucking off the government tit and getting wealth redistributed to them because they take advantage of that tax exemption? The 50% of people who don't pay income taxes is comprised of the elderly and low income earning teens and the working poor and middle class who get all their taxes paid in back at the end of the year because they, like the soldiers in combat, have taken advantage of the their legal tax exemptions. The 50% you banner around as if they are all on welfare is a myth.

The reason you have a hard time identifying with the Occupy Wall Street people is because you've got the best job security in the world if you choose to make a career out of the military, which at 29 years old seems to be the case. You know your health care and pensions will always be there and you can't be fired or laid off you keep your nose clean. If you want to find "redistribution of wealth" in the Constitution there you go. We tax payers are paying for career military personal during peace time and when they get too old to serve anymore. We provide that basic safety net that you don't think other Americans should have. Oh, wait! The pensions and health care for veterans was added after the Constitution mandated we have an army, so maybe to save the tax payers money, we should just kick the career military out in the streets when they are no longer useful to society without a dime for all their years of service. That's what Republicans want to do with teachers, firemen and the police.

Did you know that 43,000 military personal and their families once marched on D.C. to get their promised bonus money out of the government? Not necessarily related to this Wall Street thread, but I've always found that to be an interesting bit of history---that active duty soldiers were expected to fire upon veterans at a protest. Maybe Wall Street needs another MacArthur to come clean up the place, eh?

#69 TAP

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Posted 08 October 2011 - 11:53 AM

I heard on the radio that the OWS thing was cooked up by the unions to help make Obama seem more centrist in contrast.


This was obviously on the totally truthful and objective radio news network, as opposed to Limbaugh for example? :)
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#70 TAP

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Posted 08 October 2011 - 12:03 PM

Taibbi always worth another read, especially if you still think the financial crisis was because banks were forced by the government to lend money to poor irresponsible people.

http://www.rollingst...n-jail-20110216
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Posted 08 October 2011 - 12:06 PM

I heard on the radio that the OWS thing was cooked up by the unions to help make Obama seem more centrist in contrast.


This was obviously on the totally truthful and objective radio news network, as opposed to Limbaugh for example? :)


What a bunch of bull. Obama already looks like a centrist to the people who voted for him and are now disappointed in him for not being more liberal and giving in too much to the Republicans, especially to the unions who expected more out of him than the silence they got during the union-busting going on this summer in WI and Ohio. The big unions are not happy with Obama and have even threatened to withdraw their support in this next election.

#72 Mr. Roboto

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Posted 08 October 2011 - 12:11 PM

Taibbi always worth another read, especially if you still think the financial crisis was because banks were forced by the government to lend money to poor irresponsible people.

http://www.rollingst...n-jail-20110216


I read that a month or so ago. It should be required reading me thinks.
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#73 TAP

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Posted 08 October 2011 - 12:12 PM

Taibbi talking to Olbermann, raging left wing ignorane ranting......no wait, a nuanced interview with some interesting observations. Though his point that even though the protestors may not understand the particulars of what they are protesting about, it might give political capital and will to those who do understand what needs to be done on Wall Street.

http://www.rawstory....otivate-change/
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#74 TAP

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Posted 08 October 2011 - 12:14 PM

Taibbi always worth another read, especially if you still think the financial crisis was because banks were forced by the government to lend money to poor irresponsible people.

http://www.rollingst...n-jail-20110216


I read that a month or so ago. It should be required reading me thinks.



Unfortunately too many words for the people who really need to read it I think.
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#75 Mr. Roboto

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Posted 08 October 2011 - 12:23 PM

Taibbi always worth another read, especially if you still think the financial crisis was because banks were forced by the government to lend money to poor irresponsible people.

http://www.rollingst...n-jail-20110216


I read that a month or so ago. It should be required reading me thinks.



Unfortunately too many words for the people who really need to read it I think.


Why read when you've got Glenn Beck to tell you what's really happening in the world?
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