98 replies to this topic

[freedom78]

Our department's lead student advisor has stopped advising, thus the load is now dumped on the rest of us (of course, no salary increase or teaching decrease comes with this...just an ass fuck for all of us). My first advisee had to be informed that they are too stupid to take a math class needed to graduate and will have to take a pre-req at community college, just to get into the pre-reqs at my school, so that the REAL course can actually be taken. This person thought they were one semester away from finishing, and they'll now have to be bogged down in math classes for another year (including summer 2012). Just goes to show that putting off something you're bad at is not always the best idea. Had this student tackled this question sooner, they might be in a position to finish now or, if nothing else, could have saved the money of four years of college by realizing that they can't cut the basic math requirement. Also, how do you get to within a semester of graduating from college if you can't test into intro algebra (the pre-req FOR the pre-req FOR the real course)? I blame TAP.

[TAP]

My first advisee had to be informed that they are too stupid to take a math class .

Welcome to my world.

[freedom78]

My first advisee had to be informed that they are too stupid to take a math class .

Welcome to my world.

Indeed. But seriously...if you can't test into the PREREQUISITE of the PREREQUISITE, how did you get admitted to college? Were they like "I see you haven't taken any math since 7th grade...but your extracurriculars are phenomenal!"

[meathead]

Never heard of it until today, but sounds terrible.

Oh sorry, good point!

http://www.unschooling.com/

"I am beginning to suspect all elaborate and special systems of education. They seem to me to be built upon the supposition that every child is a kind of idiot who must be taught to think. Whereas, if the child is left to himself, he will think more and better, if less showily. Let him go and come freely, let him touch real things and combine his impressions for himself, instead of sitting indoors at a little round table, while a sweet-voiced teacher suggests that he build a stone wall with his wooden blocks, or make a rainbow out of strips of coloured paper, or plant straw trees in bead flower-pots. Such teaching fills the mind with artificial associations that must be got rid of, before the child can develop independent ideas out of actual experience." -- Anne Sullivan

http://en.wikipedia....iki/Unschooling


Unschooling is a range of educational philosophies and practices centered on allowing children to learn through their natural life experiences, including child directed play, game play, household responsibilities, work experience, and social interqaction, rather than through a more traditional school curriculum. Unschooling encourages exploration of activities led by the children themselves, facilitated by the adults. Unschooling differs from conventional schooling principally in the thesis that standard curricula and conventional grading methods, as well as other features of traditional schooling, are counterproductive to the goal of maximizing the education of each child.

smells conservative to me

[Zimbochick]

What is this new found hatred for the Department of Education, or is this merely a states right issue? Is standardization really that evil?

[Mr. Roboto]

EPA, Science, Education, sexuality...all bad things.

[VOR]

What is this new found hatred for the Department of Education, or is this merely a states right issue? Is standardization really that evil?

I think many people are changing their minds about the need for the USDE based on its ineffectiveness in producing an enlightened citizenry. The mission statement changes from administration to administration, but the overall goal of the USDE is to meet the educational needs of all students in the country while preparing those students to become productive citizens. Public education is also used for the purposes of social programming and has become the primary agent of political socialization. That is a secondary concern for many who think the department has overstepped its questionable authority and become too politicized.

The most common argument I hear relates to the fact that we are spending more money per student than at any time in history without achieving the expected results in terms of climbing the performance scale when compared to students from other industrialized nations. If throwing money at the problem isn't fixing the problem, then we need to look for other reasons as to why performance is not where it should be. Examining the umbrella structure of the USDE, its inefficiency and redundancy, and even its need for existing seem reasonable to me. We do have departments of education on the state levels which could work with each other to ease the movement of students across state borders by adopting general guidelines for benchmarks by grade year. A national department is not required to achieve that goal, so a lot of money could be saved and put to better use. Taxing people less would allow many parents to spend more time with their children as opposed to working. If parents played a more active role in the rearing and educating of their own children, the educational system would not be forced to do the job of both parent and teacher.

Of course, the fact that the U.S. Constitution does not authorize the creation of any such institution should be a serious concern to every American.

My nose just started bleeding. That's all for now.

[Timothy]

we don't need no education.......................

[Mr. Roboto]

The COTUS doesn't authorize all kinds of things...

[VOR]

The COTUS doesn't authorize all kinds of things...

That's true, and when any action of government is unauthorized by the US Constitution there should be concern.

The USDE's discretionary budget for 2011 is just shy of 70 billion dollars. That's a lot of money for a department that doesn't have constitutional authority to exist and is producing unacceptable results.

What are the children of this nation getting for our 70 billion dollars? Lower performance rates than children from other nations spending far less on education and a cold, hard slap in the face when they enter the job market woefully unprepared. It's time to pause, rethink the situation, and ask exactly who is benefiting from the existence of this department since the nation's children clearly aren't based on firm statistics.

[freedom78]

Or it could be the hillbillies who refuse to have their children learn all that evil science. It's amazing how much so many in this country despise knowledge and intelligence. That's a cultural problem (and there are others as well).

[VOR]

Or it could be the hillbillies who refuse to have their children learn all that evil science. It's amazing how much so many in this country despise knowledge and intelligence. That's a cultural problem (and there are others as well).

I saw a sign this week in front of a store that read:

FEAR OF THE LORD IS THE BEGINNING OF KNOWLEDGE

I think that's so funny and so sad at the same time. At least it was spelled correctly.

Yes, the educational problems in this country are multifaceted. Culture also definitely plays a role. Talking about cultural issues is very tricky, though. Nobody wants to admit certain things for fear of being branded intolerant. You can't solve a problem if you are reluctant to address it.

[freedom78]

In a democracy, I think most problems can be traced back to a cultural issue...otherwise, it wouldn't be an issue, as manifested through suffrage. I can live with "states' rights" on many things (though I despise the phrase, since it's so tied up in bigotry). I find the states to be a natural laboratory to tackle many problems, most of which are local in some way. But I do find that some issues either have to be handled nationally (foreign policy) or are of great enough import to set a national standard. I don't need some teacher telling my kid that if she can't turn water to wine in chemistry class, it's because she isn't praying hard enough. If you want to handle snakes and speak in tongues on your own time, that's fine, but school is school. I still think it comes down to culture, though. Our culture has now become one to demonize workers. Watch the news...they actually blame workers for the bad economy, as if record profits aren't occurring. We make villains out of our teachers and laborers, as if the people who work hard are somehow to blame for things. The right says the welfare state makes people too lazy to work, and then immediately turns on those who do.